hmmmmm,
they can do this, but they can only manage 2 mpg better on the hybrid Malibu? What the heck GM?

With the fuel mileage savings of the hybrid system and Silverado's 26-gallon (98-liter) fuel tank, the Silverado Hybrid has a cruising range of more than 500 miles....

How much more than 500 miles? Right at 500 miles, that still only 19.2 mpg. Not much to get that excited about.

The hybrid system found in the Malibu/Aura is a "mild" hybrid - not to be confused with this full, two-mode hybrid system.

"How much more than 500 miles? Right at 500 miles, that still only 19.2 mpg. Not much to get that excited about."

You're missing the point here when you go from 15 MPG to 19 MPG that's a 25% improvement in MPG. Wouldn't you like to decrease the nation's fuel usage by 25%? Alone it may look small but across the fleet it's huge.

Okay call me crazy but has anyone thought about resale value on these or other hybrids? I meen the batteries only last what 5 years. Who is going to want to buy a 3-5 year old truck knowing that there is a $2000+ bill waiting for them shortly after buying it to replace those batteries? Some will but not at the prices a gasoline truck will resell at.

Chris:

The batteries last quite a bit longer than 5 years. The sources that say the batteries have a very limited life-span look at the absolute worst performance the batteries can give under max drain/max recharge cycles. Also, many manufacturers offer free extended warranty service for the entire hybrid system, and have system check intervals for owners to make sure the batteries and motors are conditioning alright.

"With GM's 2-Mode Hybrid system, the electric power used to propel the vehicle is generated by the hybrid system itself. When the brakes are applied or the vehicle is coasting, the electric motors within the hybrid system create electricity that is stored in the 300-volt battery. This stored energy is used to move the vehicle and the regenerative braking cycle is renewed."

What the heck does that mean? They make it sound like:

1) The electric power that charges the batteries is 'free.'

2) If you apply the brakes more than you don't the batteries will be kept fully charged.

3) You can charge the batteries even when waiting at a stop light.

4) Regenerative braking when coasting is not coasting anymore.

Fred,
Stick with the gas version. This article seems to be way over your head...

No offense but if you were to purchase this vehicle, you would be complaining all the time about it.

If you decide to respond to me, please count to 10 slowly and step away from the computer. Think about what you want to write and formula a usefully rebuttal.

Thanks

And how would this compare to a diesel counterpart? And why don't they start making diesel hybrids already?

Fred:

1. The electric power generated by the brakes is a conservation of spent energy. The energy created by the burning of gasoline is used to propel a car. When the car brakes, the energy is transferred to the brakes and wasted through heat. Hybrid cars use that transfer of energy to charge a battery, instead of creating waste heat.

2. Not sure what you are saying

3. You can only get energy from the brakes when you are in motion and slowing down...

4. I think they imply when you coast, especially down hill, your car will speed up and you will be forced to use the brakes, thus transferring energy to your battery.

Instead of all the Hybrid nonsense and wasted batteries and extra maintenance, why don't they just design separate transmissions to be engaged for towing or normal driving? When you start the vehicle, it could reference the weight of its cargo and knows which transmission to use. Make a button so that either can be manually selected and put high gears in one and low gears in the other. Start in second, optimize shift ratio's based on intertia etc. and most importantly on a V8, turn off 4 of the cylinders at cruising speeds. Hybrid isn't going to be future, more fuel efficient engineering will make more of a difference in the long run. Alternatively how about, instead of full hybrid 2 stage system with a battery...just a buy a diesel version?

Fred:

1. The electric power generated by the brakes is a conservation of spent energy. The energy created by the burning of gasoline is used to propel a car. When the car brakes, the energy is transferred to the brakes and wasted through heat. Hybrid cars use that transfer of energy to charge a battery, instead of creating waste heat.

2. Not sure what you are saying

3. You can only get energy from the brakes when you are in motion and slowing down...

4. I think they imply when you coast, especially down hill, your car will speed up and you will be forced to use the brakes, thus transferring energy to your battery.

I bet the 500 miles cruising is not @ 30 mph! I would also like to know what excactly "capable of traveling up to 30mph in full electric mode" means. Is the word "capable" advertising lingo or does it really mean that upto 30mph the truck is in electric mode only? Does it mean that if you are towing and going from 0 to 20 mph it is only using the electric mode to get started? If so, that is some major torque the electric engine provides.

Hey Fred...

Brakes in a normal vehicle normally dissipate energy to slow it down by generating heat. This is heat lost to the air that cannot be reclaimed to do any more work. This hybrid system takes that energy that would normally be lost and coverts it to electricity to be stored in the batteries for doing more work later. In that sense the energy is "free".

Also, electric motors are more energy efficient than internal combustion engines in setting a vehicle in motion. For vehicles already in motion, the reverse is true. Therefore, less energy lost to the universe, more energy to propel your truck...therefore better gas mileage.

If you put a less restrictive intake and exhaust on a Ford V8 gas powered truck, you're getting about 19.5 MPG city- I only know this from personal first hand experience.
I wonder what kind of MPG you could get off of a similarly modified silvarado hybrid? If it starts at 19 mpg, they're really already a little behind as far as efficiency goes in my opinion (especially when you can get that already in an existing vehicle!) This is supposed to be the newest, latest, and greatest, right?

to Brad

a continuously variable transmission is in theory always at the peak of power and efficiency so there is no use to lump more weight into any vehicle with 2 transmissions that will neither be more fuel efficient or powerful as a cvt

"I would also like to know what excactly "capable of traveling up to 30mph in full electric mode" means. Is the word "capable" advertising lingo or does it really mean that upto 30mph the truck is in electric mode only? Does it mean that if you are towing and going from 0 to 20 mph it is only using the electric mode to get started? If so, that is some major torque the electric engine provides."

First, electric motors put out a good deal of torque and have constant torque at all rpms. Secondly, the whole 30 mph deal is that if you drive a hybrid like you should (which means you don't shove the pedal through the floor) then you can go up to 30 mph in full electric mode. If you cram the pedal through the floor, then you'll be using gas and electric power to move the vehicle. Understand?

@John

1. Unless they came up with something new this last weeks, there is no CVT in the market that can handle this kind of torque (think about how they work and you will understand why)

2. CVT is less efficient than a manual for a steady speed (or close to steady). There for, manuals always get better highway mpg than cvt (same model and engine, of course)

Until the day that we have batterys good enough to have an eletric car, diesel is the way to go for trucks and big cars. The reason is quite simple: Diesel cycle is more efficient than OTTO cycle (gasoline). MAYBE combined with a eletric motor only big enough to get the energy from braking and help a little with acceleration.

"The truck is also capable of traveling up to 30mph in full electric mode even if it is towing the maximum 6,100 lbs."

That alone is impressive enough. Most actual work a truck will do occurs under 30mph anyway (construction sites don't have speedways, neither do farms), and if they can move this engine into their fleet vehicles, then let their be hybrid.

As far as the concept, I still say that this car is the Big Mac of the car world. Some people actually could eat a big mac and not gain weight, but your average soccer mom or office worker will bloat like a waterlogged corpse eating at McDonalds. In the same vein, the only real benefit most people will gain from this car is step in height. Otherwise, they'd be far better off getting a new Accord, Camry, Malibu or Sonata than this.

For the record I slammed the previous post about GM including this on the Escalade. On a Silverado, it may make sense since this is a more popular/necessary vehicle. Granted the fuel savings isn't stellar, but it is tangible improvement, especially in low speed jobsite work. I like that it can go 30mph electric only even when towing. I am concerned about replacement cost and real fuel savings to a comparible diesel powerplant.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuously_variable_transmission

once again a cvt is more efficient than a manual, think about it no highs or lows as there is in a gear.

when i wrote this i briefly looked over that this truck used an EVT and thought that it may or may not be close to a CVT. So i was telling brad that a cvt is and always will be more efficient and provide a maximum power curve compared to automatic or manual transmissions and will always remain such. now if there is no transmission currently in the market that can handle this torque then so be it but a cvt is much better transmission than auto or manual. think about it

to Allen:
"...Most actual work a truck will do occurs under 30mph anyway (construction sites don't have speedways, neither do farms)..."

Nah. I bet the vast majority of the Silverado drivers are rednecks and soccer moms who just drive to work or go shopping in it.

It shows that being green can still be macho. :)

Now if they can do the same with the Hummer, it would be more appealling (IMO). Make it the big green machine. :)

I don't get the excitement over hybrids. Most (not all) hybrids come with smaller engines than what the manufacturer compares them to. Case in point when GM compare the 2.4 L green line Saturn to the V6 version. Of course you save mpg here, the engine is far smaller.

The prius, which in realistic driving conditions only gets you 35-40 mpg on the highway has a 1.5 L engine. I used to get that mpg on my old 1.8L VW, unleaded. All of the hybrids have been downgraded based on the new EPA estimates, and due to this several manufacturers have pulled their larger hybrid sedans since they received worse gas mileage than non-hybrid (Camry, Accord). A 1.5L gasoline engine will get you better highway mpg than the prius. To boost city mpg you just simply drive the way the prius manual suggests, you know like an old person.

With the prius and other hybrids the batteries add significant weight and expense. In addition the batteries are very toxic and take alot of energy to produce. Hybrids are more expensive than their standard gasoline counterparts. You pay more money for a smaller engine and less horsepower, a wonderful scam!! Many people never recuperate the costs since some hybrids can take between 6-10 years to pay for themselves, in which time they batteries would need to be replaced.

Anytime you transfer energy from one source to another, energy is lost.

Neither hybrids nor plug-ins are the answer.

Changing everything to diesel would give a better return to mpg than hybrid, diesel overall releases less CO2.

I don't get the excitement over hybrids. Most (not all) hybrids come with smaller engines than what the manufacturer compares them to. Case in point when GM compare the 2.4 L green line Saturn to the V6 version. Of course you save mpg here, the engine is far smaller.

The prius, which in realistic driving conditions only gets you 35-40 mpg on the highway has a 1.5 L engine. I used to get that mpg on my old 1.8L VW, unleaded. All of the hybrids have been downgraded based on the new EPA estimates, and due to this several manufacturers have pulled their larger hybrid sedans since they received worse gas mileage than non-hybrid (Camry, Accord). A 1.5L gasoline engine will get you better highway mpg than the prius. To boost city mpg you just simply drive the way the prius manual suggests, you know like an old person.

With the prius and other hybrids the batteries add significant weight and expense. In addition the batteries are very toxic and take alot of energy to produce. Hybrids are more expensive than their standard gasoline counterparts. You pay more money for a smaller engine and less horsepower, a wonderful scam!! Many people never recuperate the costs since some hybrids can take between 6-10 years to pay for themselves, in which time they batteries would need to be replaced.

Anytime you transfer energy from one source to another, energy is lost.

Neither hybrids nor plug-ins are the answer.

Changing everything to diesel would give a better return to mpg than hybrid, diesel overall releases less CO2.

[That alone is impressive enough. Most actual work a truck will do occurs under 30mph anyway (construction sites don't have speedways, neither do farms), and if they can move this engine into their fleet vehicles, then let their be hybrid.] -Allen

Like Allen mentions, if you're buying a truck for actual work, then then a hybrid may work. If you're the stereotypical truck commuter then its stupid. Hybrids aren't a fit for everybody. Its just a potential option and it works with great success for some.

I used to work at an international airport that has a lot of heavy trucks in its fleet. I've since talked to one of my former colleagues and for their next fleet renewal he's looking at spending the extra cash to get in hybrids. The reason he gives me is that hybrids have one advantage that non-hybrids will never have, the ability to turn of the diesel/gas engine.

For a truck to automatically turn itself off is a huge advantage. Maintenance and construction workers have a terrible habit of leaving engines running when they really don't need to be. Although you won't see a huge savings in fuel when the vehicle is constantly being driven, its situations like these where hybrids can save a lot of cash.

If the EPA conducted a test of the fuel economy of the average work truck on a job site the fuel economy would be single digits because of all the idling and low speed driving. With a hybrid, idle would be cut short and low speed driving may be slightly more efficient.

Don't bash the technology. Its another option for consumers. Put aside some of your biases and consider that this may work for some people.

"Instead of all the Hybrid nonsense and wasted batteries and extra maintenance, why don't they just design separate transmissions to be engaged for towing or normal driving?"
Been done, more or less. They make use of an additional gearbox in some manuals with selectable overdrive. They could also use a 2-speed differential for a RWD vehicle. It could be done in an auto too, not sure if it has been. Problem is, its usually better to just add another gear to your transmission and/or change the gearing.

"Most importantly on a V8, turn off 4 of the cylinders at cruising speeds."
This very same truck and many GM V8s already do that.

"If you put a less restrictive intake and exhaust on a Ford V8 gas powered truck, you're getting about 19.5 MPG city- I only know this from personal first hand experience"
That's only if you make such modifications and then keep your foot out of it (accelerate just as slowly even with the extra power). Also, such work would make the vehicle louder, something most people don't seem to want. They spent a lot of time making sure this thing was quiet. I personally wouldn't mind slapping a CAI, and high-flow cats+mufflers and delete the resonators on it, but that's just me.

"For the record I slammed the previous post about GM including this on the Escalade. On a Silverado, it may make sense since this is a more popular/necessary vehicle."
At least you're honest about slamming the Escalade. But really, what's the difference? They don't lose performance, and they both make huge gains in MPG. You slammed the Escalade because you are a player hater (tongue-in-cheek). People are going to buy Escalades and pickups, and its their right to be able to spend their own money to do so. Why not let them buy more efficient versions?

"Granted the fuel savings isn't stellar, but it is tangible improvement, especially in low speed jobsite work."
Did you read the article? It makes pretty huge gains even over the smaller and less powerful 5.3L Silverados. Which also have AFM.

I am new to the hybrid arena but from a common sense approach, does 25% increase in mpg offset the use of electricity from your home in order to charge the batteries (given the brake and coast method doesn't provide enough power) and what about the disposal of these huge batteries. not sure i am sold on the hybrid vehicles yet but love the idea of a solar powered house!

Lokks like a good effort. Man, if they had done this 10 years ago I wonder where they would have been by now.

Let's see some competition!! It'd be great to see more trucks with better fuel economy.

Which leads me to ask the question: Why not a Diesel hybrid??!

@ALexvrb:
I'll take my lumps for the Escalade post. In reference to fuel economy, it is a large gain for a vehicle in this class. The problem is referencing this fuel economy to other vehicles. I should have made that clear.( but again I am comparing apples to oranges) However, just being able to not have the truck idling to power accessories will yield tangible fuel savings. All vehicles get 0mpg when idling, the hydrid setup eliminates this.

@Tony:

I Diesel hybrid is technically feasible, the problem lies in making the technology an affordable option. Diesels by themselves command a large premium .

"does 25% increase in mpg offset the use of electricity from your home in order to charge the batteries"

..........please God, tell me you didn't just say that...

If memory serves correct, there are no plug-in hybrids in production. The main source of power for charging the batteries is the gasoline engine in the car. The brake regeneration and such is just ways to pull a little in here and there to cut down a little on how often the gasoline engine has to run to charge the batteries.

Full size pick up trucks are tools, and they can do useful things. I like that they made it a hybrid for the better fuel efficiency and also because the electric system will be able to provide electric power on job sites to power tools. Hummers are useless gas guzzlers, Pick up trucks are tools that get jobs done.

hmm how do yu compare gas to diesel? dont we have bio diesel now? and another thing if you cant afford to drive a truck getting 15 -19 mpg then apparently u need to stick to a honda civic trucks r made 2 haul and pull not get good gas mileage! i dont see any civics or 4 bangers pulling a big boat or a load of hay.. get real if u want a rice burner then buy one and leave the american horsepower alone!

hmm how do yu compare gas to diesel? dont we have bio diesel now? and another thing if you cant afford to drive a truck getting 15 -19 mpg then apparently u need to stick to a honda civic trucks r made 2 haul and pull not get good gas mileage! i dont see any civics or 4 bangers pulling a big boat or a load of hay.. get real if u want a rice burner then buy one and leave the american horsepower alone! ohh and i have a 07 chevy ext cab 4x4 with 5.3 vortec im getting 20 mpg........hmm 10 less then civic??? still lets hook up bumpers and see what happens

First off:
Attaining a 25% fuel efficiency for people who WOULD buy this machine as oppose to a regular one, I approve off,

However I personally would not buy it. I would demand a smarter diesel/hybrid scenario. With a diesel/hybrid/plugin, you get the best of all worlds. I want to be able to plug it in at home so I can utilize my own energy sources. Then when I need power, I will want to be able to draw upon a fairly potent diesel engine.
Target MPG should easily be in the 30's and when I only use electric, I would pay my 8cent per mile. THE END.

First off:
Attaining a 25% fuel efficiency for people who WOULD buy this machine as oppose to a regular one, I approve off,

However I personally would not buy it. I would demand a smarter diesel/hybrid scenario. With a diesel/hybrid/plugin, you get the best of all worlds. I want to be able to plug it in at home so I can utilize my own energy sources. Then when I need power, I will want to be able to draw upon a fairly potent diesel engine.
Target MPG should easily be in the 30's and when I only use electric, I would pay my 8cent per mile. THE END.

First off:
Attaining a 25% fuel efficiency for people who WOULD buy this machine as oppose to a regular one, I approve off,

However I personally would not buy it. I would demand a smarter diesel/hybrid scenario. With a diesel/hybrid/plugin, you get the best of all worlds. I want to be able to plug it in at home so I can utilize my own energy sources. Then when I need power, I will want to be able to draw upon a fairly potent diesel engine.
Target MPG should easily be in the 30's and when I only use electric, I would pay my 8cent per mile. THE END.

I have owned both a Prius and a hybrid Camry and as a result I have learned to drive very efficiently. I also own a 2005 2WD Avalanche and consistenty get 21.5 MPG highway and 19 MPG overall. I drive often between Norfolk, Virginia and NYC and can report that my best trip mileage using the Prius was 56 MPG and 44 MPG for the Camry (although its overall MPG is more like 35). So, learning to drive smartly costs nothing and saves a lot.