$2000 for 15 mpg more? Thats an easy sell, with as much time as BMW drivers do in City or suburban driving, that will add up.

Not to mention that I can see the 335d easily outpacing a 335i. Its horsepower numbers are only 14 lower, but the torque makes up for it in the low end. Given a long enough of race in a straight line the 335i will probably have more top end, but quarters will have the 335d as a champ.

And on track racing, well, that is really tough. I'd say the driver makes the difference there.

Track racing with a diesel? Don't make me laugh. Unless we're talking factory backed teams (Audi, Peugeot), diesel engines are iron blocks best left on tractors, they are usually much heavier, and on a front engined car, that means more weight at the wrong end.

I may be wrong, but I believe we're talking about aluminum block (gas) vs iron block, for starters. Is the transmission the same, or is it reinforced (to handle the increased torque?). I'd say the diesel version may well be 300lb heavier.

Of course, BMW being BMW, I may be wrong on that. But I would be surprised. Will they offer manual on the diesel? I doubt that too.

Update: After a little research, I was right (autospies dot com):
quote:
"At low speeds the steering in the diesel is very heavy; heavier than the equivalent petrol 335i's, probably due to the extra weight over the nose. Could be a pain if you spend a lot of time driving in town, but it lightens and resolves with speed.

For now the 335d is auto-only. You can tell it’s a diesel at tickover but it’s exceptionally quiet with almost no vibration through the control surfaces. " (end of quote)

I hate diesel sounds, vibration, etc., I'd avoid that like hell in a BMW. I'd pay premium to avoid that, not IN ORDER TO have that!

Not on a BMW for me (no problems in a large truck though, if I'd needed that), I'd rather pay more for the gas, it will not break my bank anyways.

Turbo Diesels are making big breaks into racing, and not just the likes of Lemans with specially built machines. Seat have been running their Leon TDi in the World Touring Car Championship this year to great success. It turns into corners quicker with the larger weight over the front driven wheels and pulls out the corners faster then the petrols with the extra torque. Not all of the Seats running are TDi but the TDi continually outclasses the equivalent petrol. BMW are also running there diesels in the 24 GT championships.

With this engine in particular it is in its first generation. As always with many manufacturers and particularly BMW there is a lot of room for tuning improvement. DMS automotive in the UK already have a tuning package for this engine which bring it up to 336BHP and 520 ft-lbs of torque. And this is just an ECU remap. There are other companies coming with similar remaps but DMS tends to beat everyone and get it out first.

In answer to the question on the auto or manual.
In the past with the 330d BMW dropped the 5 speed manual used in the first generation in favour of an auto when the engine moved from 184BHP (brought out in 2000) to 204BHP (2002). HP is not the problem here it is torque but I cant remember the torque figures. When the engine moved to the 330Cd in 2004 a 6-speed manual was added as an option which also became available to the 330d. The 6-speed was stronger than the old 5-spd and capable of handling the torque.
Hopefully a similar 6-spd manual will become available for 335d.

Currently in tests on a DMS tuned 335d the 0-60 times are
5.5 secs in manual mode
5.6 secs in semi-auto
5.7 secs fully auto

This is without reving the engine and letting go. Just nailing the throttle.

True there is nothing to beat the sound of a petrol engine but diesels dont sound noisy these days if however not very sporty. However from my experience at LeMans of the Audi R10 which sounded more like a space cruiser than car then the future for diesels aint all that bad

@Sphere,

Try drinving a diesel on manual and you will be very disapointed. Normally they dont pass 3500 rpm, so you have to change gears very, very often. (reason why even the slowest version of the vw rabbit diesel gets a 6 speed gearbox).

So, if you get a diesel, go for automatic (i love manuals, i got one. I had a diesel manual and it was terrible though).

A CVT that could handle the torque would be perfect.

Thanks Tony and Rafael for the valuable input. Agreed, the autos makes more sense on the diesels.

Of course, nothing beats a test drive. I'll consider a car like this next time I go shopping for a new car.

Finally, the States are getting a fine crop of new diesels. I agree with Tony that diesels have proven themselves with racing and will only improve with each next generation. I have always felt that the new generations of diesels allow the consumer to have comparable performance, without the mileage penalty of their gas counterparts.

Diesels are typically heavier than gas versions, due to structural stiffining os the block and tranny to handle the torque. BMW prides itself in handling, so I am sure they will address that weight distribution problem.

diesels like the Audi R10 dont win because they are faster its because they pit significantly less than a gasoline version, R10 laptimes are slower than the R8s. Diesels have weak top end power, and very narrow powerbands, transmission gearing isnt going to be close because of its power band, it will be slower than the gasoline version in a straight line by a good portion

2K to 3K extra? On top of the 50 or 60K for the price of the car? thats a deal breaker!!!!

~rollyeyes rollyeyes~

A BMW Diesel is like putting a TUX on a Turtle...At the end of the day TUX or NO TUX it's still a Turtle...Slimy, Greasy, and Smelly

@zzz

Yes the diesels have the advantage at Lemans where by pitting less they are at an advantage. And yet the R10 and the Peugeot 908 both top the qualifying times. Last time I checked they dont pit during a qualifying lap. Sarcasm intended.

In the WTCC they run a low lap count races with no required fuel stops so this doesn't explain how the Seat TDis are able to win.

hmmm, half of the people posting here about diesel engines still live in dark age.
Damn...
wake up people!!! I dont like diesel engines, but I cant deny them the advantages. FGI and come back later peple...

I think most of you should reserve judgement for a test drive. Yes, it is a diesel, but it is in no way like the diesels you are used to. I own a grand cherokee crd with the mercedes diesel and it is clean, quiet and surprisingly doesn't sound much like a diesel when revved; I'd expect the BMW to be no different. Also, it will have a low redline, probably around 4500 rpm, and lots of low-end torque, not unlike many American V8's. I'm sure it'll really be a sweet driver.

Oh, and as for it being slow, I seem to recall a reviewer (automobile magazine) driving a new v8 powered m3 and getting dusted off the line by a 530d WAGON (which isn't even this new more powerful engine) and not catching up till they hit 60 mph.

"Oh, and as for it being slow, I seem to recall a reviewer (automobile magazine) driving a new v8 powered m3 and getting dusted off the line by a 530d WAGON (which isn't even this new more powerful engine) and not catching up till they hit 60 mph. "

new M3 has 295 trq vs this diesel which probably has its 400 torque much earlier than an M3s, not surprised if this is true

Don't forget you fools....only 0.02 percent of future 335d drivers will EVER drive their car on a track. It is MUCH more likely to haul groceries than create g-forces in competition.

Agree with CKV -- Don't forget you're fools