Only 417hp? I'm sure with dual VVTI Toyota could pull out some more power from the engine. After all, It's got a full liter over the bimmer engine, and almost a full on the RS4. Then again, it is an FE head. I hope they decide to give the engine a high performance head sooner or later.

BTW why does HP/L matter so much if two engines can make the same power, get the same MPG, and have similar weight and packaging constraints?

It's generally known that a 2V engine has to have a higher displacement (specifically bore) in order to achieve the breathing headroom of a smaller bore 4V engine.

But if it's the same power and MPG, why do people care which method is used?

Ignorance of engine technology and wanting to feel good and justify paying more for their car maybe?

I am not hundred percent sure but I have a feeling this engine pulls the power out at a lower rpm than the other two engines. Which then makes it more driveable for the people who are not used to high strung driving. And we all know that Toyota engines are bullet proof because they are more conservative. If they have it at it's potential, the chance of failure is higher and that is something Toyota is not willing to have added to their reputation

ignore that, wrong thread :P

Yeah Toyota is known for overbuilding...

The crank in my 5SFE can hold up a sky scraper or be lathed down to stroke a 3SGTE to 2.2L and 700HP...

But it resides in a 130 HP economy engine o.O

that's why some bash toyota as boring and lifeless vehicles.....
they're supposed to be economical and reliable.

and you morons wonder why toyota engines last forever? they build for quality not performance. If you want an engine to blow up just go buy a hummer hahah.......

If my daily driver has 417 horsepower I really dont give a rat's ass if it can be tweaked to 500 ???? People who can afford these cars don't drag race at the local mcdonald's and join car clubs haha......

Yes some people who do buy cars like these drag race
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wr0fjqGV_4

The point behind this engine is that its going to rev incredibly fast and be light. Not to mention the better mileage.

If they wanted light and fast revving, they would have gone for a turbo I4.

I think effortless power from an unstressed engine is what they were looking for, hence 5.0L V8

"If they wanted light and fast revving, they would have gone for a turbo I4."-Chris

You know, there are such thing as light weight and fast/high revving V-8's...but they all have 4+ valves/cylinder and are not made in the USA. OHV engines are slower revvers due to the inherent limitations of the design compared to DOHC engines.

"But if it's the same power and MPG, why do people care which method is used?-Chris"

Simply put, because one is cheaper to make and feels like a truck engine while the other is smooth and makes power progressively throughout the power band, more akin to a racecar. Higher power/liter shows a higher state of tune = better engineering = people want better, best, etc for their money. Just compare a F430 to a Viper. The F430 is faster to 60 and probably ties in the 1/4 mile while having half the displacement.

And it cost three times as much, no wonder it's faster. Regardless the Viper is a statement of an American way of doing things(Displacement) while being unique in that it is a V10, even if a higher revving V8 could make the same power.

It just seem's a little excessive when you realize we are slaughtering people wholesale to steal their oil [Iraq] and the Arctic is melting. Sure it's wonderfull car but do we really need that much power when the speed limit is 70mph.

Noya,

Your quite wrong on few points. I would be really surprised if this motor is lighter the GM's LS6 "truck motor" Additionally it will certainly take up more space and get worse gas mileage. The torque curve of that truck motor couldn't be much flatter from 1500-red line. Those archaic OHV are smooth as glass and not as peaky as high revving DOHC engine. As a bonus they are also much cheaper to build and maintain with a lower center of gravity.

The reason they have to rev so high is because of the lack of displacement. It's a trade off. On the track the DOHC have an edge on the street the OHV will deliver no fuss power with minimal effort.

As for the Viper F430 comparison while F430 needs half the displacement is cost over 2x the Viper. It also half as reliable which is Ferrari's biggest downfall. If you managed to drive both you would also find that despite the F430 being near parity with Viper the Viper would feel much faster because of all that torque.

Even the highly critical Jeremy Clarkson loved the Corvette Z06. Drop that LS6 in that new IS and I bet it would be faster, lighter, and $20k cheaper. Go crazy and drop in an LS7 and it would be much faster still about $5k cheaper.

On the core topic it's still a long ways from an M3.

Quality last long.

F430 being near parity with Viper the Viper would feel much faster because of all that torque.-RX-7 guy

Sure....except for the fact the Viper has no traction/stability control which makes all that torque useless at slower speeds/tighter tracks, not to mention is doesn't even have a rear mounted transaxle to help with weight distribution.

You can say all you want about how OHV is better in your opinion, but in reality it is not, as the only automakers still using OHV designs are the Dwindling 3.

Even the highly critical Jeremy Clarkson loved the Corvette Z06.

And he also loves to make fun of their fiberglass bodies, leafsprings, cheap interior and every other negative that it has when considering it's a $65,000+ sports car.

Biil Owens: I think they should replace gas tanks with wood chippers. Then make cars run on polar bears and Iraqis.

If we just glass over Iraq, Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia, and oh heck, Germany too, can't we just then put in new drill heads and get the oil out?
I know, Germany doesn't have a lot of oil, but hey, then France can invade and finally win one.

"And he also loves to make fun of their fiberglass bodies, leafsprings, cheap interior and every other negative that it has when considering it's a $65,000+ sports car."

Find me another car with the same or better price/performance ratio.

unknown:
Yes some people who do buy cars like these drag race
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wr0fjqGV_4

dear moron,

What are the sales figures for people who buy a lexus that want to drag race them versus people who buy a lexus to drive as a car????

yeah glad you didnt major in Business. You can buy a cheaper car and do an engine swap and get the same performance if you want to drag race... still you missed the point! stupid high school kids making waffle fries !! genius!

A car manufacturer is not going to be like; " Gee billy bob down the street is a drag racer enthusiast, he works at mcdonalds and spends all of his money modifying his supra !" maybe we should custom taylor our luxury sport coupe to meet his needs. No no no, 417 horsepower is weak. We need to tweak the engine to at least 500 horsepower..... blah blah blah....... hahah....

Bill Owens must be Al Gore's gay lover ??? You know the ozone hole over the artic shrunk by 30% this year ??? Magic!!! Why dont you visit Iraq before you make ignorant statements based on liberal emotional logic... Liberal Smug is whats causing global warming , they like to smell their own farts...... I'm sure there is a lot of OIL BEING REFINED IN IRAQ right now hahah.. Wow those production facilities are off the charts.....

If All the senators visited one of those fun zones in iraq they would want blackwater to guard them. Stupid Haji burying 105 mm howitzer rounds into the ground blowing people up... "pink rain" what a bunch of cowards. No wonder some people shoot first and ask questions later. They want to come home in one piece not in a ziplock bag!

Of course Bill Owens is of the mindset of do the right thing. Put all of our money to goverment programs. Free Health Care to all. 90% taxes and one Stalin-esque ruler. Vote Hillary!! or Edwards ?? i need a 400 dollar haircut , i earned it chasing ambulances and suing people. Now i'm rich and want to do the right thing! hahaha.... stupid liberals!

I'm glad all of this is related to the new Lexus. I like my IS 250. Everything is George Bush's fault... I stubbed my toe this morning and it's all his fault..... Just like the weather machine that made katrina go over new orleans!

*searching for man , bear , pig *

Price to performance? Ok then, BMW 1 series. Sure, its going to lose the drag, but lets talk road racing.....

And just for the fact that its a cheap performance car does not mean the Z06 still does not suffer from the crappy interior and archaic suspension that makes the ride feel as if its made of steel AND barely, if not at all keeps up with real suspensions like whats found on most imports.

In other words, the Z06 is a muscle car that can sort of keep up on the track, but while it outspeeds Lamborghini's in the straights as many Youtube Videos will attest, it still does not do as well in the turns as other cars.

Josh, If it's really true ignorance is bliss you must be one of the happiest guy's around.

Noya

Perhaps you should view this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tztm9dLyY4&mode=related&search=

Find a DOHC engine that go from 0-175 in one gear in a production car. I'm not saying that DOHC engine aren't great but in street driving they have yet to achieve the seemless power band of the OHV. So rather than talking about something you've just read about you should go experience it for yourself. At very least support your statement by some facts that show that they are inferior. I would say that my opinion is support by more facts than "your" reality.

The Z06 is also the only super car that doesn't get slapped with gas guzzler tax for the green guys.

Your traction control point is moot as that was done to preserve the purest nature of the car. There are kit available to put traction control on the Viper. Even with out it they track pretty well on tight tracks because of there incredible traction.

At the end of the day I'm rotary guy. They blow any piston engine away from the standpoint of hp/liter. The downside is they recycle gas into pollution at ravenous rate.

// Quote // Jason:
Only 417hp? I'm sure with dual VVTI Toyota could pull out some more power from the engine. After all, It's got a full liter over the bimmer engine, and almost a full on the RS4. Then again, it is an FE head. I hope they decide to give the engine a high performance head sooner or later. // End //

Oh they could've hit 500hp if they wanted, but that wasn't the plan. Toyota wanted ULEV-II emissions with competitive power output. It is also not an FE head. The engine designation is 2UR-GSE.

"AND barely, if not at all keeps up with real suspensions like whats found on most imports."

you need to go and do some reading on the zo6, then lets have a talk on who can barely keep up with who.

it is avilebl on saudi arabia or no.