MORE ARTICLES ABOUT $150,000 GERMAN CARS PLEASE!

Because this is just not a story, sorry. Reminds me of the idiot that sued for a coffee burn from McDonalds.

Many people are under a few false assumptions that prevent them from achieving the EPA rated mpg in both city and highway driving.

The first is that they are a good driver. Many people drive in a hurry, change lanes often and apply lots of brake pressure to stop at lights. Each of these driving habits is indicative of a poor utilization of car resources. Changing lanes implies an acceleration that is abrupt and normally shortly after a deceleration as well. This change brings the car out of its optimum operating range. The heavy braking is also indicative of using too much acceleration during the interval between two stop lights.

Aside from this, most people have their tires under-inflated a little.

Personally I drive conservatively and just about always get better than EPA mpg in my car. On the highway and in town.

"Because this is just not a story, sorry. Reminds me of the idiot that sued for a coffee burn from McDonalds."

There is a misapprehension on what happened in this instance. The coffee burn was a 3rd degree burn on the "lap" and all the bodily parts located nearby. "Hot" coffee should in no way be so hot as to cause 3rd degree burns upon contact. Although I may not agree with the amount of damages, IMO the suit did have a valid case.
http://www.lectlaw.com/files/cur78.htm

EPA mileages.
I think that if a vehicle is marketed as having fantastic Fuel Efficiency...it should perform as such. If it doesn't achieve expected mileages, then some sort of recompense should be forthcoming.

Hybrids do better in city driving than Highway driving. My sis has a Prius that gets close to the EPA values but that drops markedly once at Highway speeds. All that braking recharges the batteries (yes, there is loss of energy but much less than if it was a non-hybrid car).

John True and the rest of American's who buy foreign cars should quit being a bunch of Bendict Arnolds and buy American.

Don: Are you just trolling or what? The "Buy American" argument has been beat to death. If you really belive in it - good for you.

Hybrid vehicles that use electric motors as a primary source of motion get better gas mileage in the city.

The Prius has a larger electric motor and a gas motor that can work separately and in conjunction with one another.

The Honda Civic Hybrid, Accord Hybrid and Insight use an IMA system, integrated motor assist. A small electric motor coupled with a small gas motor. The electric motor assists the gas motor in torque and horsepower.

The only reason the Insight has better gas mileage than all hybrids is that it was designed for that. It weighs less than 2,000 pounds, has a .25 drag coefficient, uses low-rolling resistance tires. Only has a 3 cylinder engine that weighs about 150 pounds or so.

If the Insight had the Prius' technology under the hood and Lithium-ion polymer batteries, it'd get at least 70MPG on the low-side. Hell, add a plug-in feature and you'll see 80-100MPG.

In a way, I'm glad the guy is suing. Everytime I watch car commercials, they are always advertising their fuel economy numbers. For those of you that watch tv, I'm sure you're very familiar with this. I noticed a huge increase this year in the number of auto commercials advertising their cars that get 30mpg or more. Next year when the EPA changes how it computes fuel mileage and all the manufacturers rated fuel mileage goes down, will they still be advertising like crazy of their 30+mpg cars that only get 20mpg on a good day?

I'm am so glad someone is making a big deal out of this. It is almost impossible to acheive EPA estimates if you are driving normally. Often times even when you drive very conservatively you can't meet the estimates. Toyota and Kia are particularly bad about this. The Corolla doesn't get 40 mpg. It just doesn't. And the Spectra sure as hell doesn't get 34 mpg. The only way to acheive the EPA estimates for some vehicles is to drive using hypermiler techniques that, while interesting, shouldn't be necessary.

You have to learn how to drive a hybrid. My Accord Hybrid regularly sees 31 MPG at near 80 MPH on the interstate now that I know how to drive it smoothly. When I first gave the car to my wife, she could barely get 22 MPG because she was so used to driving under-powered econoboxes that require full throttle 80% of the time to keep from getting killed. Now that she's more familiar with the car, she achieves 32+ MPG in the Accord Hybrid, which includes the majority of her driving in-town.

This guy should take the fee he's paying a lawyer and take a driving course. I have to admit, though, I learned how to drive my Accord Hybrid a lot quicker than 6000 miles. Maybe this guy's just dense.

Generally speaking I'd say No. This is because gas mileage is dependent upon quite a few variables that are beyond the manufacturer's control. Those being the maintenance and driving habits of its customer.

ie. Someone who does not properly maintain their vehicle will experience less performance/mileage than someone who does properly maintain their vehicle.

As an example. I drive pretty conservatively, i take off from stop lights quickly or try to get to 75mph before merging on the freeway. Doing this i normally get about 315miles per-tank in mixed city/highway driving.

One time i tested what it was like to drive like my friends. Taking of faster, not ridiculously, but pushing the RPM's up to 4,500 etc. And generally just driving without any concern to reserved revving/starting and stopping.

I found that i was only able to get 250 miles to the tank while driving this way.

Screw that.

What a load of B.S. This whole gas mileage rating is a joke. Everyone knows the ridiculous and impractical methods that the EPA uses to calculate fuel economy and there's absolutely no real-world scenario that would fit within those guidelines. I hope this guy wins his lawsuit and sends a message to the car manufacturers and the EPA!!

I get close to EPA milage, or exceed it. And I've had people complain that I drive too fast, with no complaints that I drive too slow.

But there's a big difference between 'fast' and 'wasteful' driving. I may drive fast, but I also drive very efficiently. I'm smooth on the gas pedal, look far down the road and lane change well in advance of when it will be needed, and don't accelerate at times when that would be pointless. (Such as when there is a red light ahead.)

Honda should defend in this case by taking that car out on the EPA circuit. Either it would get the rated milage, and the case would be closed, or it would not, and Honda would pay up. In that latter case, Honda should also buy back the car, to study it and see where it went wrong.

But I'd be willing to bet it would get the rated milage.

I'm laughing at Don so hard right now. What is un-American about buying cars that are not made by lazy, overpaid union workers and built on 50 year old technology? If it is American to build shit and call it a vehicle, than I cannot imagine America being on top of things much longer.

Also, Japan and Germany are our ALLIES. These are people who we once kicked the crap out of, and now we're thick as thieves. Germany may not support Iraq, I dont either, but otherwise they are two of our only friends on this earth anymore. So whats un-American about trading with your allies? If its the American thing to do to be arse and say "fuck you, my friend," then no one is more American that Hugo Chavez and the President of Iran. Both have said "fuck you" to plenty of people.

Oh and do not give me crap about not supporting Bush's war. Have you actually been there, met some troops, seen an IED? I have. I've actually been to Iraq. And Afghanistan. Pakistan, India, Sri Lanka, and Russia as well, but we are not dodging bullets and bombs from anyone of them.

I don't get it. I'm driving a 91 Honda Civic. I get 35 to 40 MPG in the city and as high as 50 on the highway. The car has a 4 cylinder engine and plenty of power! How can the new technoligy not even match a 16 year old car?

EPA is a stupid system with a formula to give an estimate. There's no way to tell what everyone's gas mileage will be. I floor it half the time so my mileage is lower than what someone else might have.

In response to zippy, the person that sued McDonalds sued because the coffee wasn't supposed to be that hot. There's a temperature that the coffee is allowed to be, and McDonalds exceeded it. Stupid, yes, but that's how it is. I saw a thing where a guy shot himself and sued the gun manufacturer. The safety was faulty, but he should know better than to point a loaded gun at himself.

I don't get it. How is this lawsuit not including the EPA? It's the EPA that sets fuel consumption methodology standards!

I don't get it. How is this lawsuit not including the EPA? It's the EPA that sets fuel consumption methodology standards! If this guy wins this case, it'll open the flood gates for millions of other people to sue every auto maker that sells cars in the U.S.

To Jim:
People are stupid. I once overheard a guy in BestBuy complain that when the store was giving $200 off a TV for getting DirectTV HD with it, he had to buy a $100 DirecHD receiver with it. How he was going to get DirecHD without an HD receiver was the question that eluded him, but you can be certain it was not the stores fault he was a dumb ass. Still, he complained and complained, until they threw him out.

The woman suing Honda doesn't have a leg to stand on. The manufacturers are simply following the law, which requires them to advertise the EPA numbers exactly as provided them by the EPA. I just looked at the sticker for my Prius (60city/51hwy, which I beat regularly) and there is small print that states clearly that the numbers are only estimates and your mileage may vary.

RE: John True and the rest of American's who buy foreign cars should quit being a bunch of Bendict Arnolds and buy American.

Hmmmm - Let me see - Generally vehicles you are calling foreign are made in the USA, and the last 3 GM vehicles I bought, one was made in Canada, while 2 were made in Mexico.

I hopthe GM Volt will be made in the USA as I plan to buy it when it comes out.

RE: John True and the rest of American's who buy foreign cars should quit being a bunch of Bendict Arnolds and buy American.

Hmmmm - Let me see - Generally vehicles you are calling foreign are made in the USA, and the last 3 GM vehicles I bought, one was made in Canada, while 2 were made in Mexico.

I hope the GM Volt will be made in the USA as I plan to buy it when it comes out.

RE: John True and the rest of American's who buy foreign cars should quit being a bunch of Bendict Arnolds and buy American.

Hmmmm - Let me see - Generally vehicles you are calling foreign are made in the USA, and the last 3 GM vehicles I bought, one was made in Canada, while 2 were made in Mexico.

I hope the GM Volt will be made in the USA as I plan to buy it when it comes out.

They should sue EPA not honda! IF the diference is that high...

There is no perfect way to estimate MPG. Thats why i always prefer to read reviews (even from other owners) instead of believing on EPA.

If you se a regular size (4 seats at least) gas car (hybrid or not) that announces more than 40 mpg, man, there a bit of a chance that its not true to real world.

of course if you put any car at steady 30mph in a straight plane road with no traffic, things change...

Seriously, these are the EPA's specs, NOT the manufacturers! If you think the EPA is off, then sue the EPA! It's ridiculous to say that car manufacturers need to be held liable for using the EPA's estimates, it's the EPA that needs to be held liable! Obviously the EPA got the EPA's estimated gas mileage, so the manufacturers are NOT lying.

Buy Canadian cars only, eh. EPA estimates are good for one thing - comparing relative gas mileage figures between 2 or more vehicles.

Prius's quite snappy but honda civic parts is also reliable. Prius can hit 100 mph but honda cannot.

This idiot should stop driving a shopping trolley as if it's a race car.

My heavily modded '03 Cobra has seen up to 25mpg (improved volumetric efficiency at low speeds is a side effect of substantial power improvements across the board, not to mention leaning out the overly rich factory tune and pumping less raw fuel through the exhaust)

EPA is 16/22, but I get 23 mpg out of a stock one with a mix of about 70/30 hwy/city driving, and that's getting on it good at least once a day, but crusing in 6th gear at 1100 RPM otherwise.

I hardly use my brakes though, I let off early, downshift and ride out the revs under deceleration fuel cutoff mode, etc.

If you go 100 mph like Gore's kid all the time and do 75 to 0 in 10 feet at a stop light like most people do, not even a Prius can save your sorry ass.

This guy is an idiot and should go to prison for his stupidity. The moron doesn't understand that fuel economy is dependent on many factor. If he drives on the highway so much then a hybrid was not the best choice. It's just like that retired judge who sued his dry cleaner for $54 million because he claimed they lost his pants. (He lost.)

"It is almost impossible to acheive EPA estimates if you are driving normally.":

So sue the EPA then, NOT car companies. They don't do the ratings; the EPA (which if you weren't aware is a government organization) does the ratings.

One thing the manufacturer never mentions is the difference among individual cars. I bought an Odyssey in 2005 which has the eco feature. So far it never reaches its claimed MPG. Later I bought a Civic in 2006 and I got exactly the 7.8 L/100KM in summer time. I am driving the same way with both. For my Civic, highway driving only it reaches 5.2L/100KM. In a trip, I drove my friend's civic 2006 with only highway driving, it was over 9 L/100KM!

I believe there are differences between individual cars. And I also believe the one the manufacturer sends for test should have been tested by the manufacturer already.

To be honest, I think they should advertise the WORST MPG instead of the best.

Felix

It might do some good to look at how the EPA actually gets both it highway, and city figures. For instance all the highway driving done on an EPA test is done @ 55MPH I don't know about you but todays highways are all around 65 to 70mph, hense the reason why they have come up with new standards for all there testing for 2008. There website now lists revised figures for previous year cars if you want to take a look at the revised estimates.

Still I don't see the reason why this is such a big issue of course millage varies from both car and driver, and f course terrain but I say if the manufacturers want to advertise estimates on TV and in ads then it's fair for a person to sue the car manufacturer over those claims.
Let this be sorted out in court and we'll worry, and complain when and if this changes something in the future.

Here's a legal question for the obvious couple of law students in the crowd.

Do the Car manufacturers actually CLAIM the EPA estimates?

The EPA provides the estimates and the Car manufacturers are required (I think) by Federal (I'm pretty sure) LAW to report those.

I don't believe the reporting is required in advertising but I'm nearly positive theyare required to post the sticker on the car.

So how does that make the Car Manufacturer guilty of False representation?

YES, CONSUMERS SHOULD HAVE A RIGHT TO SUE A PRODUCT COMPANY WHEN THE PRODUCT IS NOT FUNCTIONING ACCORDINGLY AND PROPERLY AS DESCRIBED (WITHIN ACCEPTABLE MARGIN OF ERROR AND FACTOR FOR WEATHER CONDITION MAYBE).

IT ALSO INVOLVES A TEST METHOD MODIFICATION USED BY AUTO INDUSTRY. THEY SHOULD ALSO LIST SPECIFIC MPG ACCORDING TO DIFFERENT WEATHER CONDITION.

FOR EXAMPLE:

1. 70F, NYC MANHATTAN ROAD, 20 MILES RUN.
2. 70F, HIGHWAY, 20 MILE RUN.
3. 85F, AC TO 70F, NYC MANHATTAN ROAD, 20 MILES RUN.
4. 85F, AC TO 70F, HIGHWAY, 20 MILE RUN.
5. 25F, HEATER TO 70F, HEAVY SNOW, NYC MANHATTAN ROAD, 20 MILES RUN.
5. 25F, HEATER TO 70F, HEAVY SNOW, HIGHWAY, 20 MILES RUN.

THEN CALCULATE AVG MPG, WITH RESULTS FROM ABOVE LISTED AND VERIFIED BY EPA.

I AM USING A 1994 TOYOTA 4RUNNER WITH ITS WINDOWS STICKER AS NEW PURCHASE FOR MPG 16/23. I AM STILL USING IT NOW AND STILL MANAGE TO GET AVG 13MPG USING AC, AND 8MPG IN BAD WINTER TIME IN HEAVY SNOW. THIS IS WHAT I CALLED ACCEPTABLE FACTOR.

IF I PURCHASE A HYBRID CLAIMING MPG 50/40 BUT ONLY DELIVERING 23 IN SUMMER USING AC AND 18 IN BAD WINTER TIME IN HEAVY SNOW, THEN THIS IS VERY SERIOUS DIFFERENT FROM WHAT THE MANUFACTURER CLAIM. I AM MOST DEFINITELY GOING TO SUE.

I think we should be able to sue anyone who types in all caps.

Now there's something on which I can agree with you, DaMinority. ;)

The problem with that, is that I can get WAY better than EPA, or WAY worse depending on my driving. Iv had my old accord down to less that 23mpg, for a whole tank, and up to 39.12 mpg for a full tank, just by changing driving. No doubt on a closed course, I could easily get down in the teens. If this guy wins, I will get a Prius, and hammer that pedal, I bet I can hit teens with it. That should net me millions from Toyota. They are lowering the ratings now, all that does is say its ok to drive like an idiot. Go ahead and raise the gas prices, Im ready, are you? I can get 32.7 mpg out of my G/F's 2002 Monte Carlo, mixed driving. and if I try hard, I can easily get down into single digits. YMMV....

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I think that if a vehicle is marketed as having fantastic Fuel Efficiency...it should perform as such. If it doesn't achieve expected mileages, then some sort of recompense should be forthcoming.

we should , i know toyota advertised corolla , ' we all know the corolla gets 41 mpg' later changed to 37 , both are bullshot figures and toy knows it , they purposely lied to sell these pieces of junk , my 95 corolla got 37 and above consistantly so what moron in toy redesigned the disaster they are selling now ???