To be quite honest, no result will come, they will just notice that the saturn and the malibu look cheaper, take em out for a drive and youll really notice a difference, the malibu and saturn wont feel near as nice, handle as good, or accelerate as good. But w/e keep trying GM.

Exactly what Mike said....the things that GM and Ford and all those other car companies need to do it get their butts in gear. Showing off a Camry and/or an Accord is NEVER going to help them because....

1. Those cars run better, more efficiently, and are just put together better. Any mechanic that says buying an American made car is better is lying to you, they fix so many more problems with said vehicles.

2. Those cars LOOK better. Better exteriors, better materials...not to mention better interiors by far. Ever gotten in a GM car? The dash looks TERRIBLE. The buttons on the center console feel cheap and breakable.

If they want to make their car sell better, they need to improve the car, not throw competitors cars which are superior right in front of potential customers.

I dunno...I think Toyota interiors look like trash. In the Camry, the color of the dash lights is not even the same as those on the center stack. For a nice interior, try sitting in a base VW, like the Rabbit. It runs circles around that Toyota junk masquerading as "good quality."

The new Saturn Aura looks really sharp, and I think it's great that GM is willing to put their cars up against the Japanese. They've finally got a top notch, European-based product (that won North American Car of the Year) and they should be proud to show it off!

When is GM, and Ford going to wake up to the fact that they are only looking out for themselves and not the consumer. Japanese cars sell better cause they are not selfish like American car companies who capitalize on everything we sell. GM makes such a profit off their cars it's a rip off. GM only knows how to sell junk. The only think that GM has LEAST in the last 40yrs that was worth anything was the electric car. They pulled the electric car cause they couldn't make money off their customers after they purchased the vehicle and drove it for 10k miles. American car companies are only concerned with Greed. American car companies are going to lose more of the market after gas goes up to $4.00. WAKE UP AMERICA AND "DO ON TO OTHERS AS YOU WANT DONE ON TO YOU" Stock holders don't care about anyone except their profits.

When is GM, and Ford going to wake up to the fact that they are only looking out for themselves and not the consumer. Japanese cars sell better cause they are not selfish like American car companies who capitalize on everything we sell. GM makes such a profit off their cars it's a rip off. GM only knows how to sell junk. The only think that GM has LEAST in the last 40yrs that was worth anything was the electric car. They pulled the electric car cause they couldn't make money off their customers after they purchased the vehicle and drove it for 10k miles. American car companies are only concerned with Greed. American car companies are going to lose more of the market after gas goes up to $4.00. WAKE UP AMERICA AND "DO ON TO OTHERS AS YOU WANT DONE ON TO YOU" Stock holders don't care about anyone except their profits.

I don't think it's such a bad idea. The exterior of the current Accord is ugly. The Camry is a little better. The Saturn is definetly the best looking of the three. I think the Accord interior wins honors above all 3, and the Aura and Camry are about tied in ergonomics and quality.

Camry's have always been known for their poor handling, and while this generation is supposed to be better (as they always say at the start of a new generation) the Camry is still not crisp. Grandma should love it though.

The Accord has always been more athletic, and it probably still edges out the Aura and Malibu, but again, it has that butt ugly exterior.

GM is making progress, they're not where they need to be yet, but they're closing the gap. If only they didn't have all those legacy expenses to drag down the investment in product.

The interior of toyota cars are awful.

The best interior are in the german car vw ,audi, bmw, mercedez.

With the time the honda product especially the accord seems cheaper.

By far the honda of the 90's are more reliable and solid than the 2000's .

GM is improving but need to change the look of their car.

There is some nice coup like the pontiac solstice.

I've been in the market for a new car, and funny enough, I've driven all 3 in the current model year. Things I've noticed are the sound systems, ergonomics, interior quality, drivetrain, and overall driving experience.

I'd say the Aura has the best sound system. The accord in the same price range had a pretty lacking sound system as did the Camry. Ergonomics, I still like the Honda the most (personal preference). Overall interior quality, It's definately a tie between the Accord and the Aura. Very tight interior, potential for rattles, imo, is pretty low. Camry just didnt feel as tight. Acceleration was more linear in the Aura compared to either the Accord or Camry, but the Accord still felt slightly quicker. Braking was great on all 3 (but I'm no braking expert here haha). Overall driving experience for my buck, I'm torn.

The Accord I want is a few thousand more than the Aura, but the Aura is just as good for my dollar. Honda has the legendary reliability, but the Saturn is no slouch either. I've owned a 96 SL Saturn, as well as a 2004 Accord EX V-6 Coupe 6 speed. I really don't know which way I am going to end up going yet, but I know that both cars are very well built vehicles.

I disagree with those of you saying the Japanese cars will run circles around the Aura. Both of the American companies mentioned have created relatively nice sedans (Fusion, Aura) and are as reliable, if not better, than Camry and Accord. In fact, I've heard alot more complaints about the new Camry than about the American models. The fact that I was hearing any complaints about a Camry astonished me. What I'm trying to say is that there may be a changing of the guard on the way.

Guy's in a perfect world GM would be a great company if it wasn't so cheap with parts. Those parts were out and you have to replace them. Toyota and Honda have parts that were out too. Though the different is time. GM 50k Japanese 100k. So in the long run you save the money. Less part equals better investment. Again the electric car was the greatest thing GM ever did. Then they just trashed it in a world of Global warming. So did Japanese companies. So they are all bad for turning their back on a world solution towards the environmental problems we are in today. The GM is the biggest car company in America and if the japanese didn't do what they did 30 years ago we would be driving cars that handles and mirrors etc would being falling off. I've never trusted GM cause of Greed. All their hybrids get less then 30mpg, Hello what's that right there. That's not a hybrid, that's an Accord hauling another Accord. Buy Japanese because they are doing something about Global warming. GM is pretending to and getting rich behind not doing it. Rent "Who destroyed the Electric Car" Excellent Movie!

It's interesting, when comparing Honda and Toyota against American makers, people always lump Buick, Pontiac, Caddy, Saturn, etc. into GM (same is done with Ford and Chrysler). Why don't they do the same with Acura and Lexus?

Anyways, my point is I've been a longtime GM owner (Buick, Olds and Chevy). However, my wife has been a longtime Toyota owner. That is, until this year and she bought a Chevy. Why did she switch? Because for the money, she got more from Chevy, repairs will be cheaper and the reliability is about the same.

Also, don't forget that US and Japan automakers SHARE parts nowadays. Many of the entry level autos share the same engines. Dials, Knobs and switches are pretty much all manufactured in the same factories whether they're for an Accord or an Impala.

Dig deeper into the statistics. GM seems worse than it is, but that's only because GM makes more models, sells more cars and sells more less expensive cars to people who are less inclined to spend money of fixing something thats "going wrong", or take as good a care as a Honda/Toyota owner. People are just harder on American muscle.

Hilarious! GM is actually going to BUY Toyota and Honda vehicles at RRP, and then put them on show in their dealerships?
Insane..

1. GM is giving the competition business and free advertising!
2. Potential buyers who weren't looking at the Camry or Accord now get a chance to be all touchy-feely with the competitor models, which may in fact lead to a sale of a Camry or Accord.

May have sounded like a good idea at the marketing meeting, but in business terms, this is sheer stupidity!

Parting thought... GM/Ford/US Car makers are big in the US, and no where else. Yet Toyota/Honda are the respected, purchased and supported worldwide. Wonder why?

What an awesome idea

Have the opposition cars inside the showrrom for comparison.
Loosen a few bolts here, create a few rattles there. Detune the engine and make it run harsh, deflate the tires a bit. Put some poor quality gas in the tank.
Take the customer for a drive in the oppositions car and bag it the whole trip. Get into yours and it runs like a dream.

Ya know, it might just work.

People blame corporate greed for the high price of American made cars. That is only part of the story. One should include UAW/union greed too. UAW members are the highest paid workers in the USA yet every year they want more. One should also include the saftey standards that the DOT impose on cars. One should not forget the huge lawsuit payouts whenever some one is hurt in/on/by a US auto make vehicle (the lawyers are the only ones who make money off lawsuits). Add all these up and one gets expensive American made automobiles.

TomLeeM, I'm seriously disinclined to agree with your opinion. Labour costs, minimum safety standards and quality standards are a requirement of every manufacturer worldwide, hence your assertion is not unique to the US industry.

Why is it that the US motor industry produces consistently poor quality product when compared to Japanese and German manufacturers? Even the flagship models (Mustang, GT40, etc.) are not serious competition for their European/Asian counterparts. Yes, they go fast, just don't try turning or braking, or looking at the fuel bill!

Quick question... is any US vehicle manufacturer ISO 9000 certified?

Will probably be a base model Camry and Accord which will look cheap compared to a decked out Aura. Saturn is putting nice interiors in their cars now and it isn't a slouch performance wise either. It could work out well for Saturn.

@SR

You are obviously uninformed. Ford just won a large number of the Best Quality awards for the 2007 model year, with the Mustang leading the pack.

@Ford Haters

I own and drive a Honda Accord Hybrid and a Nissan Titan SE 4x4. I have test driven many, many vehicles in the course of buying these two. I would have happily bought a Fusion if the center dash didn't dig into my knee as I loved the engine and all-wheel-drive system. The Fusion feels every bit as well assembled as my Accord. I chose the Titan over the F150 simply on cost as I was able to get a Titan with everything I wanted for less than an F150 with the same features. The Titan's interior is impeccably built as is the F150's. Ford's vehicles have really come up in quality and the choice of purchase is now more owner preference than anything else. No matter what your economics teach tells you, a car is not just a car to someone about to take on $400 per month in debt.

The problem for GM is that this is about customer retention rather than bringing new customers in, which is what they need. Non-GM customers have plenty of experience with Japanese cars, and a detuned, poorly-maintained example at the GM dealer isn't going to fool any of them.

This is about reassuring longtime GM customers that, you betcha, Japanese cars aren't as good as the 'liberal elite' thinks -- the high point of car manufacture in the 90's was, in fact, your Olds Aurora that you'll be trading in. Have some chewing tobacky?

It is also a fine PR stunt. But, alone, it won't bring in new customers.

Oh, and Ryan #2, I had a '96 SL, and I call Total BS on your post. Panel gaps as wide as the panama canal. Sluggish acceleration. The plastic panels aren't as rugged as you're led to believe. The 'check engine' light turned on when I floored the accelerator. Steering at high speeds (> 30 mph) was extraordinarily dicey.

It wasn't a lemon, but an Accord it was most certainly not.

@Payton Boyd - so Ford's won a whole bunch of quality awards? Who was the competition, what was the judging criteria, who was on the adjudication panel and how were the results determined? It's all well and good winning awards, especially when you're patting yourself on the back. Don't believe everything you read!

Interesting move. I could signal that GM feels it's product will come out of such a direct comparison ontop.

If they are correct, kudos to GM. If they are not, it'll be egg on their face.

From an entirely cynical point of view, GM could load the deck here. They could pick competitor cars which are equipped to give GM products an edge. And since each dealership will only ahve one Honda and one Toyota, those two cars will get test driven for more miles than the GM products, simply because it's a GM dealership and they will have lots of Saturns/Chevy's.

Still, it's a risky strategy unless GM truly does have good product. It'll be interesting to watch.

@SR:

http://www.thetorquereport.com/2007/06/ford_takes_the_crown_with_five.html

Will they sell me the Accord? ;p

I always find it funny that people who don't even know what the inside of the new Saturn Aura sedan looks like can make blanket statements. Truth be told, my wife owns a 2005 Accord EX and the Saturn Aura drives smoother and handles better thanks to that longer wheelbase. You also get so many more standard features in a GM product then either Honda or Toyota. I agree that in the past interior quality has been lacking in GM vehicles however that has recently changed starting in the 2006 model year cars. The Aura also has a longer warranty then my Honda. Holds it's value almost as well and is less expensive. If you really think that Honda or Toyota is so much more reliable then GM products then you should look into the big problems that Honda has been having for years with their transmissions fitted to their V6 models or the very serious sludge problems with V6 Toyota cars and trucks. I am traditionally a Japanese car buyer choosing to read and accept everything that Consumer Reports has always said about American Cars. I owned 3 Honda's, 1 Toyota and 2 Nissans. Truth be told I now own a Buick Lucerne CXS and its the best car I ever owned. At 36 I never thoughts that I would ever buy an American car let alone a Buick but I woke up and found out that GM is making much better cars then in the past. Just spend a little time driving some of these cars for yourself and you will see what I mean. 1 Year and no problems with my Lucerne CXS. I can't even sit inside my wife’s Accord anymore because it feels like a tin can to me.

Just a correction on the title of this article - GM isn't going to be BUYING Toyotas and Hondas to put in their showrooms. GM is renting them. Not a huge difference I guess, but these demo cars will not count as additional sales for Honda/Toyota.

SR

"Parting thought... GM/Ford/US Car makers are big in the US, and no where else. Yet Toyota/Honda are the respected, purchased and supported worldwide. Wonder why?"

Maybe because people from ALL OVER THE WORLD immigrate to the US, and then still buy the cars they're used to. Wonder why all the caucasians, indians, asians, etc.... drive foreign, its because they ARE foreign.

A quick question to pretty much ALL of you. Have you ever been in, driven in, or more importantly, drove any of the vehicles that you're criticizing? Doubtful. Statistics will only go so far and hold so much weight. You can read all you want and form your own opinions.

Until you stop reading, and taking all those critics' opinions with so much enthusiasm and actually get out there and DRIVE some of these vehicles you're degrading, should you form the basis for any of these arguments your debating.

I live in the US, and hence will buy US. I will support the country that supports me, in good times and in bad. This is my opinion. Don't bother retorting with some anti-American debacle. I don't care, frankly.

Drive what you want when you want because you like and enjoy the vehicle. Your stats and statistics mean little to me and to everyone else but yourself.

Re: Greg

Sorry you might want to read the full article: "The dealers will buy the Toyota and Honda vehicles themselves..."

GM orginally said that Chevy is going to rent them for the their showrooms, but it looks like Saturn dealers are actually going to buy them.

Green,

One correction, depending on where in the world you are is how well GM/Ford products sell. One shining example of GM winning is in China. It's being estimated that in 2010 China will pass USA for the largest market in the world. Back in late 2005 (Correct me if I am wrong) GM pulled a head of VW to become the number one manufacture in China for car sales. Did you know that they sell more Buicks in China then they do here? Toyota does not even come close to GM in auto sales in China. If China will become the number one market in 2010 then I would like to add that GM has a serious Ace up their sleeve to over take the number one spot from Toyota assuming that Toyota passes GM for world wide sales. It's really sad and pathetic to see uninformed people who sit on the high horses and say things like GM=BAD and GREEDY. JAPENESE = GOOD and GIVING. Give me a break. They truly are clueless. To make my point I need go no further then Nissan! Since their relationship with Renault in 1999 to lower cost on their parts you will notice that many Nissan products now rate poor for reliability and quality. Last I checked they were a Japanese company? Cutting quality to make higher profit? Ohh Noo, not from Japanese Company. After all they care about you and your family. HOG WASH!!!

I have to respond to the 4th post by "Pat". Obviously the guy has no idea what he's talking about regarding profit margins. As someone who works in the industry let me shed some light...GM, Ford, and Chrysler make less money on their vehicles than any other major brands. GM, aside from their ultra expensive SUVs, will only make a couple of thousand from their average vehicle models. Ford and Chrysler are in the same boat for the same reason...legacy costs. Legacy costs from a workforce that has been in place for decades. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, etc all make great profits from their vehicles because they don't have a union workforce (UAW) bleeding them dry. A big 3 union auto worker retires and draws an enormous benefits package. Also, it is nearly IMPOSSIBLE to discharge a union employee. You end up getting stuck with generations of dirtbags that collect benefits from you for 50 years after you spend 20 years trying to get a decent 8 hrs of work out of them. The UAW will be the cause for the demise of 1 of the big 3 if it happens. Level the playing field, remove the legacy costs and the UAW from the equation and the companies would run neck and neck with the imports. The quality gap just isn't there anymore. It was, but not any more.

These are the very vehicles GM should be pitting themselves against. It's a step in the right direction. Kepp trying till you get it right and the customers will let you know. They don't have to be better than the competition but just as good. There are still plenty of people around the world that would be happy to buy US cars.

Re: Casey

I did read the whole article, but the previous article on this topic suggested that they'd be renting them. I was mistaken. Thanks for showing me the error of my ways.

According to Bloomberg news, about 425 Saturn dealerships will participating. Looks like 425 sales for Toyota/Honda.

Interior and exterior look which car better ?? I personally care much more about reliability ! I want a car that can run 200K miles or even 300K miles without big $$ spending on fixing engine or trans or other parts weekly, monthy, or yearlyyy. Good GAS mileage counts a lot too when soon GAS will be $ 4.00 !! Over all , reliability and good GAS mileage will win my pick !

I just have to say one thing:

Pat and SR or the biggest morons i have seen on a forum in a long time. Learn some basic facts and stop regurgitating propaganda dumb fucks.

One thing i thought was hilarious, the electric car/ hybrid shit you spout. Electric cars are stupid because they can't run very long, and they are not as effiencient as gas cars because they use eletricity from generation plants, and thats not as effiecient as just burning gas. Plus for eletric and hybrid, the heavy metals in the batteries are far worse for the environment than CO2.

FUXING MORONS!!!

Sorry - thought this was a conduit for intelligent discussion. Thanks "green" and "Canadian" for reminding me of the sheer unadulterated stupidity of the average forumite - people who have nothing to say, but can't STFU.

Someone said that that GM sells more in china than the Toyota/Nissan... That probably is true.. but why? simply they sell it cheaper than the sell it in the US (lower production costs outside) and their fighting for market against the almost awful asian cars (excluding japan)... Come on! everybody knows that those asian cars are REALLY cheap made... and the feel that are not, loose the price advantage...

Other person said, that foreingner buy foreingner cars because its what they are used to... give me a break.. i brazilian and lived in the US for two times... and the only cars that we have in brazil that i would buy while in the US would be the Fusion, Civic, and VW's, Audi, Mercedes...

Someone said that that GM sells more in china than the Toyota/Nissan... That probably is true.. but why? simply they sell it cheaper than the sell it in the US (lower production costs outside) and their fighting for market against the almost awful asian cars (excluding japan)... Come on! everybody knows that those asian cars are REALLY cheap made... and the feel that are not, loose the price advantage...

Other person said, that foreingner buy foreingner cars because its what they are used to... give me a break.. i brazilian and lived in the US for two times... and the only cars that we have in brazil that i would buy while in the US would be the Fusion, Civic, and VW's, Audi, Mercedes...

Re: High GM sales in China vs Japanese car makers. I wonder if nationality has anything to do with that?

I honestly don't know if this it right, but I have heard that the chinese still carry a great dislike and distrust of the japanese over events during WW2. Is it possible that has a damping effect on the sales of japanese cars in the chinese market?

(As I say, I don't really know. I'm hoping more informed persons might respond.)

Ford, GM are not really US companies! Honda and Toyota are not really Japanese companies! They are multinational and public - anyone can buy their stock.
Examples of the globalism:
The most popular car in China: Buick!
Honda and Toyota are both made in the US.
The Ford Focus, Mazda 3 and Volvo S40 are the same car, made in Belgium! The SAAB (a GM company) 92-x is a Subaru (partly GM and Toyota) WRX. BMW has a plant in the US. Chevy has used Suzuki engines.

None of these companies are truely based in and accountable to any particular country.

Ferrari is owned by Fiat; Kia is owned by Hyundai;
Ford owns 1/3 of Mazda; Lamborghini is owned by Audi/VW (which is partially Porche); GM owns part of Toyota and Daewoo.
Toyota also owns part of Isuzu.
GM Manufactures in 33 countries.

People just don't get it!......GM will never be able to compete with their Japanese rivals, no matter how better looking and handling their cars turn out to be. In the mid size automobile market people look for long lasting reliability and excellent resale value......something GM still struggles to accomplish. In addition to that Americans, whether they like to admit it or not, remain faithful to their vanilla Camrys and Accords. Hey...what more can I say...Its the culture!

Stew,

There are plenty of Americans that are just as faithful to GM/FORD and to a lesser extent Chrysler automobiles as well. As for reliability, the quality gap simply is not as wide anymore. Many American made cars rate up there with their Japanese counterparts. One of the big three Japanese manufactures (Nissan) actually rates lower then Ford and GM now for quality. Second, truth be told, resale value has been an issue in the past. Part of that is perception most of that is the fact that GM/Ford traditionally sold many of their models to big rental car agencies at very thin profits. 6-12 months later these cars were flooding second hand markets depressing the big three resale values. There is a real reason why you don't see any Honda and few Nissan and Toyota rental cars. That's because Jap manufactures deliberately restrict sales to rental agencies to maintain resale values. As of 2006 GM has significantly curtailed sales as rentals. This effort is already having a very positive effect on some models such as V6 G6s who are enjoying resale values almost as high as Honda Accords.

I think it would be rather amusing to ask the Saturn dealer if I could buy the Camry because the local Toyota dealer doesn't have that model in stock.

Never let the defendants handle the evidence. Didn't we learn this from OJ's trial?

I got three words for ya'll: Toyota buys GM.

SR:

"Sorry - thought this was a conduit for intelligent discussion. Thanks "green" and "Canadian" for reminding me of the sheer unadulterated stupidity of the average forumite - people who have nothing to say, but can't STFU."

You just posted a shining example against yourself with this very retort, being a bit hypocritical don't you think?

I never resorted to petty name calling, insinuated or likewise.

I was merely responding to your previous posts, I didn't realize that, upon seeing such writings with a *gasp* different opinion than your own would throw you into such a fit.

We all have differing opinions! I'm rather unsurprised to the fact that because we do not agree on the subject matter, you have belittled your own self and stooped to a level of which you claim everyone else to be.

And I quote: "Pat and SR or the biggest morons i have seen on a forum in a long time. Learn some basic facts and stop regurgitating propaganda dumb fucks."

And I quote: "I never resorted to petty name calling, insinuated or likewise."

You shouldn't be allowed in public without adult supervision.

@green:

Ignore my last post - mixed you up with Canadian.